Sara Emmerson: Welcome back to That Sounds Risky. Today I'm joined by my friend Dave Hunter. He is also the owner of Green Room Productions. And just a little bit about Dave. Dave made his living in theater for more than a decade before bringing his experience in visual storytelling into the world of video production. Since then, he has traveled the world producing videos that help businesses and nonprofits tell their stories through marketing, training, and advertising. And he hasn't left the stage behind. Dave still performs improv comedy monthly with Green Room Improv, which currently has 2 resident theater locations. He and his wife Martine live outside Chicago and have 3 beautiful daughters. And when I hear Dave's story, I wanna know more about the decisions behind it. So I'm sure you do too. Moving from theater into video production, building a business, and stepping onto a stage without knowing exactly what's gonna happen. all involve a willingness to embrace uncertainty. Today we're talking about trusting your creativity, navigating change, and taking meaningful risks before you know how everything will turn out. So Dave, I'm so glad you're here. Here. Welcome to That Sounds Risky.

Dave Hunter: Hey, I'm glad to be here. And this, just doing this podcast feels risky.

Sara Emmerson: It, well, doing this with me probably does feel risky for you, Dave.

Dave Hunter: So, no, no, no, not just with you. There's, there's always this like pressure to like, do well and be a good interviewer and, you know, have things come out that are helpful. So hopefully—

Sara Emmerson: Well, you're doing great so far. You've got lights behind you, a great blue jacket.

Dave Hunter: Yeah.

Sara Emmerson: So far so good. Everyone gives you an A so far.

Dave Hunter: Okay, good. Now, now he starts talking and it goes down.

Sara Emmerson: Well, I mean, we'll see. We'll, we'll have people vote at the end, see if you get voted off the island. I'm kidding. Um, so Dave, take us back to the beginning. What drew you to theater and what And how did you make your living doing that for 10 years? So many people want to do that, and you actually did.

Dave Hunter: Tell us about it. Yeah, yeah, it was, uh, well, I got into theater like in high school was really when it kind of kicked in for me. I played basketball my freshman year of high school, and then my sophomore year of high school, I tried auditioning like for the play, and I got Young Scrooge in A Christmas Carol. Turns out I was just better at performing on stage than I was performing on the basketball court.

Sara Emmerson: Performing at basketball, you were trying to play the part of the basketball player?

Dave Hunter: Basically, yeah, yeah. And so I was like, okay, maybe I'm good at this. So I took some classes in high school, like, you know, children's theater. And then we would, we would go and like perform at children, like local elementary schools. And, and then I won, actually my senior year of high school, I won like most likely to succeed in theater. They give like a theater award to like a male and a female. So I won that my senior year. That was the first award I really ever won. And so I went to school and then I majored in theater, or like a version of—

Sara Emmerson: How did like— yeah, tell me about that. Like, even I know for many of us, when we personally like something and then people, um, give us accolades outside of just our personal desire for it, it helps cement things in our hearts.

Dave Hunter: Yeah, that's such a thing.

Sara Emmerson: How did that help? Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, decision—

Dave Hunter: yeah, I mean, that's so true. Like, sometimes you don't know like who you are or how good you are at something until somebody tells you or communicates that to you. And even if I back up a little bit, before I got that award, there was actually one other award I won before that. I assistant directed my senior year in high school. I assistant directed a one-act play, like the ensemble of this one-act play, not the play itself, just the ensemble. They gave me the ensemble to do whatever I wanted to do with them. Ensemble, yeah. And they got together at the end and they got me a little Oscar and wrote, wrote a note, like, thanking me for being such a good director for them. And I was, like, shocked. Like, I teared up, you know, because I'd never gotten that kind of, like, recognition from peers. Yeah. You know?

Sara Emmerson: Right.

Dave Hunter: And, and so I still have that Oscar, like, right over here. And I was like, oh, wow. Like, first of all, they care about me and they appreciate what I did. And then secondly, maybe I'm good at this. And then I won the award when I graduated, and I was like, oh wow, my school thinks I'm good at this. Maybe I am good at this. So it definitely gave some confidence and some identity to be like, hmm, maybe they have a point. So I went into college with that, and I was going to be a theater major. And the freshman year, my freshman year, they actually canceled the theater program. Oh. a group of students and me, we all got together. I was actually invited into this and they were like, hey, what if we start our— let's just do our own show, you know, and we'll, we'll like reserve the theater space and we'll do like some sketches.

Sara Emmerson: Well, yeah, nobody else was using it at that point.

Dave Hunter: Totally. I mean, they would use it for like recitals and stuff, but like no theater. And they would have classes in there. But we're like, well, what if we do our own show? We'll have it be a sketch comedy show and maybe we'll do some improv. And then it'll be free. We'll do it for one night. So we did it and we called it the Green Room. And then it was really successful. Like, we sold out even though there was no charge for tickets. So then we're like, hey, let's do it again the following year. So we got together and we actually wrote all the sketches this time as opposed to just collecting sketches. We wrote them all. Yeah. And then we were like, let's charge $1 for a ticket so we can buy some props. And then we said, let's do 2 nights. We'll do Friday night and Saturday night and see if we can do that. And no joke, Sarah, 45 minutes before the show started, we— a line began forming outside of the theater to get into this thing. And we sold out both shows. We had people sitting on the floor, um, and we're like, wow, we're onto something. And then that spring we decided—

Sara Emmerson: You're like, we're gonna be able to get some more props.

Dave Hunter: Yeah. Yeah.

Sara Emmerson: That's amazing. We can get better props next year. Yeah.

Dave Hunter: And then we, we said in the spring we started like a little improv competition. So if you can get an improv group together, we'll have a competition. And then we got like the president to be one of the judges. We got 3 judges. We got the cafeteria lady, the president, and like a professor.

Sara Emmerson: I love it.

Dave Hunter: And they were the 3 judges and they would decide who won each round. And then there was a final winner. And then we started getting hired to go off campus, like to go like perform for this local Christian school prom or this convention in Indiana. So we like borrowed the van from the school and drove to Indiana. And then we graduated and we're like, well, a lot of us are still local, so what if we just keep doing this? So I incorporated it into an S corp right out of college as a 22-year-old. And then we just kept doing shows. We started doing like a once-a-month improv show at the school. And then we would write murder mysteries and things like that and get hired for gigs. And then a local theater—

Sara Emmerson: And how many years ago was that?

Dave Hunter: Oh, that was 20— not, not trying to date

Sara Emmerson: you here,

Dave Hunter: but yeah, that was 24 years ago.

Sara Emmerson: And it's still going today.

Dave Hunter: It's still going today. Yeah. So we, we actually, it eventually blew up into like a full season of shows and season tickets and we would do musicals and plays and ensemble things and improv shows every month. And we, we started selling out the theater at the school. So we actually moved off campus because we, we had to, we did a 7 o'clock show and we sold that out. So then we added a 9 o'clock show. And then that started getting full. So then we just moved out to a bigger theater and then went back to just a 7 o'clock show. And now, now we are the— we're at the Hemmons in Elgin and then we're at the Rao in Crystal Lake. We are their local in-house improv group now that they promote and sponsor and, you know, advertise. And that's the, the one theater thing I still do to this day.

Sara Emmerson: That's amazing. Well, we're going to get all of your information at the end so people can check out. But if they're listening right now and they're like, hey, I want to go to the improv show, where do they find information on that?

Dave Hunter: Yeah, greenroomimprov.com. That would be the easiest. Or Instagram @greenroomimprov.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah, follow him, go see him. I've seen the show before, it is so great. And we were just talking before we pressed record here too that I definitely need to come see it again. So, um, yeah, all of us need to.

Dave Hunter: And we don't have a bunch of, uh, 80-year-olds, you know, still doing it. Like, there's been a lot of, you know, new, new people come and go, you know. So

Sara Emmerson: yeah, because you're 80, right? Yeah, sure. Yeah.

Dave Hunter: But fun fact, there are still a couple of us from the college days that are still doing it, including the piano player and myself. Um, but yeah, it's kind of crazy.

Sara Emmerson: That's wonderful.

Dave Hunter: Still doing it.

Sara Emmerson: It is. And so you started that and that actually started to create your career for you in essence, even though—

Dave Hunter: Yeah, I also got hired like out of college by like a local children's theater company to to direct shows and become the artistic associate for all the shows they were doing. And then I also became their tech director. And so I was doing that while I was still doing Green Room and directing musicals and producing shows. And then Judson University, that's where I went to college, they actually hired me back to restart the theater program and start recruiting students to the program and building it back up. Incredible. So I did that for a few years. So, you know, with all of that, I was making a living doing theater. Uh, and just kind of hustling.

Sara Emmerson: So one of the things that I think is so interesting, no matter who it is that I'm talking to, I, I find often that it's, um, seasons or, or times in our lives when things don't go like we thought they were going to, that it forces us to take a risk. Sometimes our risks are chosen, but sometimes they're chosen for us. And for you, I think back to that moment where you had signed up for school, you had gotten these awards, you were excited to major in theater, And you get there and they're like, womp womp, sorry, the theater program is done. And at that point, Dave, you could have chosen to just be like, all right, well, I'm gonna become a banker. Right?

Dave Hunter: I'd be a terrible banker.

Sara Emmerson: Well, I don't know how good you would be.

Dave Hunter: I feel you, I feel you.

Sara Emmerson: But you could have chosen to play that part just like you played the part of the basketball player.

Dave Hunter: Yeah.

Sara Emmerson: Right? But what was it that you were, what in that moment, And maybe you hadn't even defined it at that point, but it, there was something that stirred you and spurred you on to keep going when everything else said, nah.

Dave Hunter: Yeah. Well, I mean, to be honest, you know, I was invited into this, uh, you know, it, it wasn't like my idea. I did become the director, um, because I had some natural leadership ability, but I was asked, do you wanna do this? And I was like, sure, I'll do this. But to then continue to go on, like to have, you know, a little success, but for people showing up to a show for free and then deciding, hey, what if we write it this time? And what if we add—

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: 2 days? And what if we charge money? You know, like we definitely had some, let's see if this hap— works. Let's see if it happens, you know? that was to it. But it was, uh, you know, there's a passion there that we wanted to do this. And we, uh, you know, if it didn't work, if it failed at that point, you know, it was, uh, sort of a lower consequence, you know, than if you— if I have a mortgage or something, you know. So,

Sara Emmerson: yeah.

Dave Hunter: We're like, let's go for it, let's do it. And that kind of— the energy and the passion and the group of people we had, it was attractive to people. They wanted to they wanted to see what we were doing.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah, well, that's exciting just to know that one, when we get invited into things, I think we still have a choice. Like, you still had a choice to go, yeah, this sounds like a good idea, or not.

Dave Hunter: Yeah.

Sara Emmerson: But, um, I think for so many of us, there's— I look back at times and I go, I was invited into different spaces that I didn't necessarily have the pedigree for or the background to do. Um, you obviously had Um, the, the skills, um, or they wouldn't have invited you in that moment. But I think sometimes we can negate those invitations and we can, um, just look at it as like, yeah, no, you know what? I'm too busy, or I'm too this, or it doesn't sound like it's gonna be a big thing. Like sometimes we only wanna take the risk if it's gonna be big enough or if it's gonna be shiny enough or if it's going to be a sure thing. And I love that in this moment you're like, what else? What else am I gonna do on the Friday night? Why not? You know?

Dave Hunter: Yeah.

Sara Emmerson: So, um, yeah, any of you that are out there listening today, um, listen for those invitations. When those invitations come or those promptings come, that's where you can really start to, to take control of your journey, really. Because at, at that moment, if you would've said no, your journey could've looked very different.

Dave Hunter: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And, and, and we had to continue saying yes. It wasn't just the first yes, it

Sara Emmerson: was

Dave Hunter: multiple yeses after that.

Sara Emmerson: Absolutely. And you got, you had a choice every time. At each time you could have turned right instead of left, right?

Dave Hunter: Yep. Yep.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah. So in that you grew this to a, a big thing. This was your profession for more than 10 years. Tell us, let us into how do you go from doing that to deciding, you know what, I'm going to shift, totally pivot and start a video production company.

Dave Hunter: So what was happening was I was making my living doing theater in all of these different ways and all of these different hats I would wear. And, and I loved it. It was sort of my dream was to make my living in theater. Mm-hmm. And so I loved it and I didn't have any intention on doing anything different. Um, I was at the time doing like video production as a side hustle. So I would like in my 20s, you know, do a wedding video for a few people or make like a, Uh, promo video for this, uh, theater company or make, uh, like film shows, like musicals on DVD and sell the DVDs to the parents. Mm-hmm. Or make a camp video from the theater camp and sell that.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: To the parents, you know? And the way I tell the story is that my, my theater friends grew up and went on to legitimate jobs. Yeah. And then what they needed was like a promo video for their company. So they're like, hey, well, Dave works with actors and directs and he does some video, so maybe he can make a little commercial or promo for us. So they would hire me to make this promo, and then, uh, so I would make it, and then they were like happy with it. So they're like, hey, let's do 2 more. And then they would refer me to somebody else or some other company, and they're like, hey, we heard you do— we have this company thing, we want to do this for social media or whatever. And so it was like a side hustle, and the side hustle began to grow naturally. And while I was still straddling all these roles with theater, and I'm like, oh man, I really can't. It grew to the point where I couldn't do all of this anymore. It was too much. So I had to sort of make a decision. So I decided to let go of some of my theater accounts that I'd had for many years and say, I think I'm going to stop doing this and open up space and see what happens over here because it seems like it's growing and this pays a little bit better as well. But at the time I didn't realize this, but there's a lot of crossover skills from theater directing and production

to video directing and production. It's just a different medium. There's a stage in one and there's a camera and a set in another one.

Sara Emmerson: Another, yeah.

Dave Hunter: But you're still working with a bunch of teams and different types of people and, you know, a variety of weird people and regular people and, you know, people who are comfortable on stage and not comfortable on stage and comfortable on camera and not comfortable on camera.

Sara Emmerson: We've worked together on some of those video productions. For some of you listening, I don't know if you know this too, but I used to, uh, produce live events and videos too. And so Dave and I got to know each other through that. And yeah, we have been on set with some interesting, interesting times, right?

Dave Hunter: Yes, absolutely.

Sara Emmerson: Definitely.

Dave Hunter: And, and I, so I came to like the video production world, like not from a tech guy sort of background, but it was more from a creative direction. producing background. Like, that's actually what I was really good at. And it turns out if I could— that was what was really valuable for people, was not like, can you light something and make it look good, but can you help me tell the story? Or can you help me figure out a cool idea to do, a way to do this? Or give me— make my idea better. And that's really what the skill was that I was bringing to the table. So it kind of caught fire. And that was, you know, probably 15 years ago now. And now we have a full, we have a staff with payroll and, you know, we're doing stuff all over the place now. Now there's videos I don't even see that get delivered, you know, to clients because we have so many, so much going on. And, but payroll, payroll's a thing. So yikes. Talk about risk.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah. Talk about risk. So we're gonna, we're gonna talk about that in, in just a second. But it's risky to say no to something that's going well. To go towards something that's a maybe.

Dave Hunter: Yeah.

Sara Emmerson: Or that even though it's growing, there's still that risk and has— Yeah. Yeah.

Dave Hunter: 'Cause it could have dropped off 'cause I had a couple big clients and if I lost one or two of those clients, like then it would've been like, oop, that was a mistake.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah. Would you consider yourself like, have you always had a risky personality or would you consider yourself somebody that, um, is comfortable with risk?

Dave Hunter: Well, I, I feel like as I get older, I become less comfortable with risk. Mm-hmm. And maybe because of the consequences are higher. Um, but when I was younger, you know, I grew up poor, so I didn't really have much growing up. So to make any money at all when I was in my 20s was like, I can't believe this. They're gonna pay me $15 an hour.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: And I get to do what I love, you know? So I, I've always sort of been content, I guess, with little, like very little. And so as more comes, it's always like, I can't believe this, you know?

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: So, I've always had that, even when I was doing like odd jobs, you know, here and there. I was always like, I can't believe I get to do this. You know, I can't— it's just I'm so blessed to be able to do this. And I think that partially comes from not having some high expectation for being rich or making a lot of money, or I just wanted to like make money doing what I love. That's like, that was my baseline. And if I can do that, like, wow, who would not be happy doing that?

Sara Emmerson: You know? Well, and your gratitude, I hear so much in knowing you. I know that's a part of who you are and, and your, um, heart and faith in all of that gets, um, uh, gets molded together is what I'm thinking. But all of that just creates who you are as a business owner in such a beautiful way that I think that gratitude really does start with, hey, if, if I'm ex— uh, expected and given little, Um, and I'm expected to do well with that, then more will come. And people see that in you, Dave. Like people really do see that gratitude, that graciousness that, um, I look at whenever you come onto a set. You talked about how you expand people's ideas or you maximize the, the video to be better than it could have been. But you do that not just in a technical way, but in a human way. Like people know if Dave's on set, his graciousness, his kindness, his care is coming with him. Yeah. And so I can only imagine that that is part of why people refer you, why people continue to ask you to come back, and why it exploded 15 years ago to be what Green Room Productions is today.

Dave Hunter: I appreciate that. I, I do. I do always have a feeling of like, wow, I can't believe they're trusting me with this. This better be good. Like, we better do a good job with this, you know, like, because first of all, the next project's never guaranteed. Mm-hmm. And whatever the story is we're telling or the videos we're making, I always feel like, oh, there's pressure to do this well. Like we better do a good job and do the best we can with it. You know?

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: I, I do walk in with that sort of, I guess it is a gratitude and, uh, I wanna make the most of this.

Sara Emmerson: How did you go from being an entrepreneur really? Right. You start the, the video production company and it's you and maybe a couple different people that you're bringing in and contracting at first, correct? Yeah.

Dave Hunter: Right. Yeah. Just me. And then, yeah, hiring.

Sara Emmerson: And then you start to realize I've gotta be a business owner. I have to be a boss. Like each of those steps are scary and risky. And being a creative and being a business owner can be conflicting sometimes.

Dave Hunter: Yeah, it can. Especially, you know, when you're young and you don't know, like when I started, you know, when you're in your 20s, you know, you're like, I've got like an 18-year-old in college right now, and I say, you know, when you're at that age, you're like part dumb and part adult, you know?

Sara Emmerson: I like to call it adult-ish.

Dave Hunter: Adult-ish. Yeah, totally.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah, they're adult-ish.

Dave Hunter: And I feel like I was sort of like that in my— with like hiring people, because like basically for the most part, I'm like just bringing friends I know, like, hey, can you do this? You know?

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: And what, what, what do you— what you don't know at the time is that when you start hiring your friends There's like— now you have 2 hats you're wearing. There's the friend hat, and now there's the coworker hat, or the boss contractor hat, or the director actor hat. And sometimes friends cannot distinguish between when they're wearing what hat, so they can take offense when you're in boss employee, and they're like, I thought we were friends. Why are you— telling me what to do or, you know, enforcing expectations or— Yeah. Uh, you know,

Sara Emmerson: why are you mad that I'm late? And you're like, because you're late, but I'm your friend. Nope, you're still late.

Dave Hunter: Yeah, like, like, right, exactly. I mean, that's a great little example, but like, it really gets complicated. And with the improv group, for many, many years, it was basically friends from college that were doing improv together. And as you grow up and create systems and expectations, it's it gets dicey, you know? So it's like there's a lot of sort of— I made a lot of mistakes when I was younger and had to learn from them. You know, people— I used to like offend people back in the day and be confused why they were offended. I'm like, what is it? What's the deal? Like, because I and my wife and I have a favorite phrase we use, which is like— and this is what I used to do— is the phrase is stop expecting you from people. So I would think I would sort of communicate to people and treat people how I would expect to be communicated to, or expect a response from them like how I would respond, which is like, okay, got it, moving on. Different people are different, have different personalities. And there's a little bit of— even with your kids, there's like, they're born different. So what works for one kid doesn't work for another kid. And even my oldest is so different from me and my wife. That's Why it's such a favorite phrase of ours, because we for many years were like, why aren't you just doing what we would do as a kid? You know?

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: And, um, so I had to learn some of that emotional intelligence in the trenches with apologizing and having long conversations and figuring out, oh, I guess I could see how this could come across this way. And, you know, that sort of thing.

Sara Emmerson: Well, definitely the relational risks that we have to take as a business owner are Many and often, right?

Dave Hunter: Yeah. I mean, it's almost easier to hire somebody you don't know. Not almost. I think it's often easier to hire somebody you don't know and have expectations for somebody you don't know and then fire somebody you don't know than it is to do any of that with a friend because you oftentimes enter into it with great intentions and great whatever. But then after a certain amount of years, a certain amount of life changes or whatever, It's, it's tricky. It's tricky.

Sara Emmerson: It is. Um, I remember growing up, uh, one thing I remember my dad saying, and, um, not that he would say it often, I just remember this random thing, but he was always like, yeah, you don't want a friend fixing your car. He's like, because then, then if it doesn't get fixed right, you like, you, you wanna be able to go back to the, you know, to the people. And, um, that's not always true. Obviously, if you've got a great friend that has a, that has an, a great auto, uh, automotive shop, that's a, a great thing. Uh, but it's, it does get to be like that sometimes where you're like, yeah, it's great. I'm gonna hire my friend. And that can work. And some of actually my closest, uh, friends are people that I managed or that I was over, um, at one time. But that relational, um, that, that relationship can get tricky sometimes as a business owner. Right.

Dave Hunter: Yeah.

Sara Emmerson: And you like, I mentioned, so what would you say to other bus— no, go ahead.

Dave Hunter: Well, I mean, that's why the knowing the hats is really helpful, you know? Mm-hmm. You know, because like, Sometimes it's helpful to just clarify what hat you're speaking from. Like, hey, I want to say this something as a friend, not as a coworker. Or, hey, I got my boss hat on right now. I just want to say this. Yeah. Sometimes that's helpful to clarify when you're in that situation with somebody, because then it helps them filter who this is coming from. Because it's not that you're a different person, but you're in a different role. When you're hiring a friend, you're, you're playing multiple roles together, and you got to be able to play those roles and separate the roles. And, and, you know, because like oftentimes with friends too, if, if I'm working for a friend, you know, I might talk to them differently or treat them differently than I would if they were not a friend or if they were just a client or something like that, you know.

Sara Emmerson: Absolutely.

Dave Hunter: And, and so I, I gotta be careful with that. And if, if we're speaking as a client You know, relationship, then I, I should treat them that way and, and vice versa.

Sara Emmerson: Well, and helping employees understand too, there's gonna be ways that you speak to them without the client there, right? Yeah. And, uh, understanding that once you're in front of the client, you can't just speak like your friends anymore. You have to be speaking like your coworkers and, and things like that.

Dave Hunter: Like, I'm not gonna slap your butt in front of the client.

Sara Emmerson: No, you're probably

Dave Hunter: not. Probably not.

Sara Emmerson: No, no, no, probably not.

Dave Hunter: Probably shouldn't do it in real life too either. But, but some people do that. No, no, I know people do that.

Sara Emmerson: who do that. You're talking hypothetically.

Dave Hunter: I'm, I'm saying I've heard of people doing that.

Sara Emmerson: Yes. No, you can't. Actually, I was at a big event that I was managing, um, a live event in Florida for a very large company, an IT company that I won't name. And the president of the company got on stage. This is, there's thousands of people there. And he did that to, um, the co, uh, leader, or I think she was vice president.

Dave Hunter: Oh, and it was a female?

Sara Emmerson: It was, and he literally got fired on the spot. So, oh yeah, it was, talk about an event. Um, when you produce, wow. And how do you produce? I'm like, uh, uh, oh my goodness. I don't know. Roll background music. Let's, I don't know. What song do you choose for that? I don't know.

Dave Hunter: You gotta talk about risky.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah. Talk about risky. That was not a good one.

Dave Hunter: No, not a good risk.

Sara Emmerson: Um, but, uh, going back to the building of the business, right? You look at building the business. in and of itself. You go from that single business owner to the, I'm hiring other people, I'm bringing, I'm taking on other, um, clients. I'm actually growing the business. Talk to us about that. Going from that entrepreneur mindset to business owner mindset, what's different and what were some of the risks that you took maybe that went well or didn't?

Dave Hunter: So I've got 2, I've got 2 major milestones I would talk to about that. The first is right around 2017, I think, or 2018, I basically had grown the business to the point to where I felt like this is as far as I know how to go. I think I've reached the limit of what to do next or what, what could make things better. So I actually hired a business coach, and I've never— I'd never done that before. That seemed really risky. You know, I hired a guy that I met at a different, like at a party for another business. And, but pretty soon into it, I started realizing all these ways he was helping me. Mm-hmm. With proposals, with how I was pricing things, with, I mean, one of the first things, one of the first big conversations we had was he asked me, how many jobs do you win that you submit for? And I said, I would say 8 or 9 out of 10. And he immediately goes, your prices are too low.

Sara Emmerson: Correct.

Dave Hunter: And I go—

Sara Emmerson: I would tell you too.

Dave Hunter: I go, what?

Sara Emmerson: Yeah,

Dave Hunter: I should be getting 10 out of 10. What do you mean my prices are low? And he's like, no, you should be getting less than that because if that many people are going for it, then that means you're leaving money on the table and should be raising your rates. And it blew my mind that because I was thinking I should get 10 out of 10 and he's thinking you need to get way less than that.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: And I just could not fathom losing more work. I mean, that's what I would equate that to, was losing more work. So hiring a business coach really changed and grew me and challenged me. And I know, I know you're a business coach, so shout out to Sarah. If anybody's thinking about hiring a business coach, she's a good one. But that was the first major thing for me and committing to that money for— I think I did that for a year. It's like a year contract. And then I, I was like very happy with it and very quickly renewed that. But then, um, a few years later, I, I hired my first full-time employee and that was my next really big sort of change and very hard. And I've heard it said that your first employee hire is your hardest one. I had hired contractors and freelancers for many, many years. That was never a problem cuz it was attached to a project. So there was no real risk cuz as long as I had the project, I could pay them from the project.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: when I hire somebody now full-time, now they're going to get paid every month no matter what happens. And it's a set amount and I can't change it. And likely it's going to need to go up over time. And that was very scary for me. Very scary because now I have to make sure that that income is coming in and even more than that is coming in. And so I hired my first full-time employee in 2020. It was during the pandemic, and we, we had actually a lot of work coming in because a lot of, uh, people and organizations needed more video now because they needed to communicate things online.

Sara Emmerson: Absolutely.

Dave Hunter: And not in person. So we got pretty busy that year, and that's when I hired my first full-time employee. He's still with me to this day, 2026, uh, end of 2026, and he's gotten multiple raises and he's been great. And now we've— I've hired multiple other employees since then, and it definitely gets easier But that was really hard, really hard to swallow, really hard to figure out what the number was. And also figure out what's the arrangement like? Are we going to get an office space? Are you going to work from home? And we currently, we have a full work from home structure. So we work remotely, all of us. There's no office space because I ran a bunch of numbers and I was like, I just don't think it makes sense for us to get a space if we can do our jobs at home. and see each other on video shoots.

Sara Emmerson: Well, especially since most of your video shoots are not in, quote unquote, you're on set at your production house. Correct.

Dave Hunter: Yeah.

Sara Emmerson: You're going to the clients.

Dave Hunter: We're going to them. Yeah. I would say 90% of our shoots on location with, at their places. And then the 10% where we need to find a place, it's easier to rent. And then also it's like,

Sara Emmerson: absolutely.

Dave Hunter: And also it can be, we can rent closer to them as opposed to they had to come out to our studio. And we can change the different spaces we rent. So visually it looks interesting.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: Um, but that was, uh, that was a tricky thing to figure out and to, and to make that commitment.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah. So personally taking on that risk, you're, you're, you take that on and talk to us about like the inner dialogue of like, you, you're getting ready to do this. You know that this isn't now, before you could kind of be like, hey, if I made this last month and this, this month, Our family will figure it out. But now you're opening it up to more than just you and your family. What's that inner dialogue that's going on in your head?

Dave Hunter: Well, the inner dialogue is now I've committed to this, so I don't want to cancel on this guy who's now committed his livelihood to join us. So now I have a responsibility to him that I didn't have before. Because before it was just as needed. And the guy I hired, he had been working with me off and on for many years as a freelancer. So he knew our system, he knew how we edited things and all this kind of thing. So it was an easy hire in the sense of who it was. It was not an easy commitment to make financially because now I'm like, now this is a multi-year, probably. Like, I don't want to have to do it for a year and then cancel on him.

Sara Emmerson: Right.

Dave Hunter: And then there was a certain amount of like, are we going to work well together? Like, I've never had somebody 40 hours a week.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: And now we're on a team, you know what I mean? Like now it's me and somebody else. Like before I'm just only answering to myself.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: Now I'm like answering to him. So like, do, should we do meetings? Like, like what do we do?

Sara Emmerson: It's just figuring it all out.

Dave Hunter: Do we go do team building? You know?

Sara Emmerson: Yeah. You're like, I don't know, do we go mini golfing? Like what do we do?

Dave Hunter: Right, exactly.

Sara Emmerson: And I think that's what so many people, um, when I'm working with clients too, they're like, well, how do I do this? Where's the handbook? And what I'm hearing you say, like, you just make a decision and figure it out. Like, there's not—

Dave Hunter: That's exactly right.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah. There's not a handbook for it. There's not a right or wrong way.

Dave Hunter: No.

Sara Emmerson: Um,

Dave Hunter: I, I had help from my business coach and, and I did, and I know an HR person who does HR consulting, so I called her for advice.

Sara Emmerson: Correct.

Dave Hunter: Like, I reached out to anybody I knew that, like, can you help me about what to do? So like the HR consultant sent me a couple papers, like, you should have them sign this. And I'm like, what is this? Like, I-9 or whatever this stuff is, you know, these things. You're like,

Sara Emmerson: oh, we should

Dave Hunter: make this legal stuff that I should, you know, I should probably do, you know. So I just basically asked for help and then people gave their opinions and I sifted through the stuff and I was like, all right, here, I think this is good. But we didn't have any handbook, you know, we didn't have any department that goes through things with them. It was just like, I think this is how we do this. Can you sign this? Uh, I don't know.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah. Right. And figuring it out. And that's a lot of what you're doing. I mean, Even though you hadn't done that in business, the reality was you'd been doing that for years because you, you were really great at improv. And a lot of what you do, uh, with improv, stepping on a stage and figuring it out in the moment. Tell us about that skill transferring to business.

Dave Hunter: Yeah. So yeah, I've done improv for a really long time now. And the way improv works as a team is, you know, a lot of people after our shows, they, they tell us, you know, I could never do that. I can't believe how fast you guys are up there. You know, that kind of thing. But the thing about improv is that it's a team sport. It's not a go out alone and improvise for 5 minutes by yourself. That's different. Improv is like—

Sara Emmerson: That's a monologue.

Dave Hunter: That's a monologue.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: And this could do an improvised monologue, but we don't really do a lot of that. And so there's— in improv, there's rules that govern making decisions. For example, you don't want to deny what somebody creates. If somebody says, hey, let's go bowling, You don't say, no, I don't want to go bowling. Let's go to the beach. Or if somebody says, man, I can't believe it's raining outside, you don't say, it's not raining. Look how sunny it is. That's just denying. So there's a set of rules for improv that you got to master the rules, and then you got to master how the games are played. But then as long as you're working within that with other people who are working within that structure, you do it together as a team. And you make decisions and somebody else supports you, and then you support what they're doing. That's called yes-anding. You know, you, you yes what they say.

Sara Emmerson: Yes, and.

Dave Hunter: And then you add something to it, and then they add something to that. And then you're building together. And so to a certain extent, you know, going through the entrepreneurship journey, it's sort of similar where I'm stepping out into the world and stepping out into business and be like, okay, I think this is what I do. And then I call in help, you know? Like, like I said, the business consultant was a big one for me, bringing in an employee and getting their opinions and their advice and hiring people who are good at stuff I'm not good at. For example, like taxes. Like I said, I need somebody to do my taxes. I don't want to be doing my taxes alone. So I need to find somebody who I can afford that can do that for me. When I need to like find an attorney for something, I like call people, hey, you know, an attorney who can help me with this thing? And then they do that. And so everybody's sort of playing their role. If you will, in the team. And, and my job is to just play my role and then admit when I don't know something and ask for help and then figure things out as I go. You know, it's on, on stage, there's also a certain amount of, um, who's going first, you know, like we get a suggestion, somebody's gotta go first and make, make the first move.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: And then every— people start, you know, Adding to that. And so I've gotten decently comfortable at making the first move on stage. And I suppose in entrepreneurship, that's what we're called to do is be the leaders.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: And so we gotta step out, we gotta make the first move and then see what happens and then, and then decide from there.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah. And I think that's so important to remember in, um, business and in, in starting, uh, any company is that I think we're so afraid of starting things or of, of getting it wrong. Right? There's so many people I talk to and they're like, well, what if I don't do it right? But remembering that you, you don't get just one try. You can make a decision, you can go first, make that decision, and if it doesn't go right, you can pivot.

Dave Hunter: Totally.

Sara Emmerson: There's so many things.

Dave Hunter: Happens in improv all the time. In fact, sometimes we take the mistakes and then those become funny later. And then, yes. And in entrepreneurship, it becomes part of your story. This thing you did that didn't work, and then you moved and then adjusted and then But you wouldn't have never got, you wouldn't, you wouldn't figure out the right way if you never make the first step. You gotta make the first step.

Sara Emmerson: Tell us about a time, I wanna hear 2, 2 things. Uh, one, I wanna hear about a favorite project that you've worked on, and then I want, uh, tell us about a time before you get to that though, about a time that you, um, actually maybe pitched something and it didn't go well. A project that you were on that didn't happen the way that you wanted it to. What was a risk that you took that you were like, Man, there was a lot of learnings in that.

Dave Hunter: Okay, I have a vulnerable one that's recent, so I will not name the company, but there's a company that I've been working with for many, many years, and they were bought out by a larger company in the past several years. And then one of my main contacts there, I've known her for like 10 years plus, probably, she got promoted to like a marketing position in the larger company. So she reached out to me, This was, I think, last year, last year or 2 years ago. And they had a large project where they— it was video of interviewing this scientist and then doing some 3D animation on top of it. And so I gave her a quote and I was like, yeah, we can do this. And I subcontract out the 3D animation stuff we do. The main 3D animator that I wanted to use suddenly could not— was not available for like a month and a half, and it was due before then. Yeah. So I went with another guy who we worked with with 2D animation. He knows how to do 3D, but he had never done a 3D project for us before. And the client was like, you know, if this goes well, we've got 2 or 3 of these in the can to come after this, you know. And it was my first foot in the major marketing door of this large company. Yeah. And with this lady that I had a multi-year history with. And the video part

that we did with scientists was was great because we did that internally. And then the 3D basically became a disaster. And after about round 4, they, they pulled us off of the project and went to another agency with it. And they paid us like a percentage of what the total was, you know?

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: And I haven't heard from them since. And so it was so painful. It was so painful because it was a risk I took on somebody who was unproven. Like, if I could go back, I would just communicate with them, my 3D guy who I trust, who we can do with this, can't do this until this point. Can you wait for then? Can you wait until then? And if you can't, I might just have you go with somebody else and then we'll take the next one.

Sara Emmerson: Mm-hmm.

Dave Hunter: 'Cause they might've waited. It turned out it took longer than they thought and took longer than we thought. And they were willing to move the date in order to get it done right. But we were moving so quickly and we didn't have the process ironed out in terms of what should we get approved first before we move second and third. And he came on late and I wasn't really creative directing. I kind of just handed it to him and was moving on to other things. And I came in when there was— it was not working well and started helping. And oh, it was a mess. It was a mess. And I haven't talked about this at all to anybody. This is internally. We're just— it's so much— it's so painful for us, you know. Yeah. But, um, he wasn't proven and it was too big of a risk for too large of a client. You know, if it was a small new client or something I didn't have much of a relationship with, maybe.

Sara Emmerson: Mm-hmm.

Dave Hunter: But this was a big deal and this was a big opportunity. And I, I've always sort of approached things with like, yes, and then we'll figure it out. Uh, but there's a certain point at which if you can't figure it out, you gotta admit that sooner than later. Yeah. And be honest about it. And, uh, we just couldn't figure it out. So they pulled us from the project.

Sara Emmerson: Well, thank you for your vulnerability in that and telling us. Um, and yeah, I think that often is what happens. It, we get really good at the yes and, and things are going well and you knew this person and it felt safe and it felt fun and you saw the extra things coming. And so all the signs were like green, green, green, green. And I think one of the things that we have to recognize as business owners Um, is when to say like, no, uh, uh, I see, see some things here that, um, I need to slow down and make a, a better decision on before we, we agree to all of it. Yeah. Or before I get so excited. 'Cause I think that's the hap— what it's so natural to get ex— to get excited about the opportunity, to get excited about the future projects, and instead of recognizing the hurdles of the one that you're actually working on. Yeah.

Dave Hunter: And in that specific situation, what they needed us to do was like, um, be like a consultative company. Like, not just, not just, uh, taking a ticket and making it, but also tell them we need more time for this, or we suggest we do this or go this direction. Like, we needed to be the experts and train them on what was needed. And we— he was unproven in that area, and I didn't have a process laid out. Or know what, what the process would be.

Sara Emmerson: Mm-hmm.

Dave Hunter: And so it was just a, it was just a huge learning that, you know, we were not in a position to be the experts because I lost my expert.

Sara Emmerson: Mm-hmm.

Dave Hunter: In

Sara Emmerson: terms of space, well, and owning your, yeah, owning your value and what you're good at. I, I think some of the things that are saying yes loudly for the things that you know well, and then saying no just as loudly is, I think we sometimes fear that if we say no or we say wait, it's gonna lose us the project when actually that's gonna give them more respect for for you because you're owning who you are, you're owning your expertise, and it actually makes people trust you more rather than trying to tell everyone, oh yeah, we can do that, we can do that, this guy can do that. And, um, that natural desire to serve or to, um, impress or to do well is gonna be there for all of us as business owners. But it also can bite us in the butt because,

Dave Hunter: yeah,

Sara Emmerson: because we get, uh, ahead of ourselves. It's like when you get out above your skis, you're gonna fall down.

Dave Hunter: Yeah.

Sara Emmerson: Right.

Dave Hunter: Yeah. Yeah. And there's, you know, there's a point at which, you know, confidence, uh, exceeds competence.

Sara Emmerson: Mm-hmm.

Dave Hunter: And you wanna try to stick to things you're competent in or can get team members who are competent in, yeah, to help you with.

Sara Emmerson: And be leery when you feel too confident.

Dave Hunter: Yeah.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah. For, I mean, that can happen. Yeah. That, well, that can happen to all of us. Just always having a recognition of, if I feel really confident in this, what am I missing? What is the angle that I need to be aware of that maybe I'm not paying attention to right now?

Dave Hunter: On a positive note, uh, with the favorite project that you asked about.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah, let's hear that.

Dave Hunter: There's a church in Ohio called Cedar Creek Church, and on Halloween weekend they were having low attendance back, you know, many years ago, and they decided to make it more of an outreach type of a Sunday. Mm-hmm. Because we have churches and nonprofits as clients and

Sara Emmerson: yeah.

Dave Hunter: also school districts and then businesses. And so they found us and, well, what they started doing on Halloween Sunday is they made it like an outreach event. So they would do like Halloween-type songs in the service. They would do a message about like a spooky story from the Bible, like Lazarus being brought back from the dead or something like that.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: That you wouldn't normally maybe teach on. And then they did a choose-your-own-adventure video series. And so they sent us an example of one they did internally. which was there's some teenagers around a campfire talking, and then they hear like a noise, uh, in the, in the woods. And then the video stops and it says, do you want to go see what the noise is, or do you want to go hide in the house? And so the congregation has like paddles and they'll vote for which one, you know, they want to see. They want next. Call to action. And then the host will interview like, why do you want to go hide in the house? Or why do you want to go investigate the noise? And then, all right, final vote. and they put them up and then they play that next video. And then at the end of that video, there's 2 other, you know, choices. 2 other options. And in that particular series, it was like you're trying to stay alive. And so they go, you know, we've been doing a couple of these. The first one was really bad. The second one was pretty good, but we just can't do this internally. It's too much for our team. And we've got Christmas right around the corner, so we'd like to offload this. So they offloaded it to us 3 years ago. They had a creative director internally that had written one. So it was We did. We took over all the production, like finding the location, hiring actors, doing the animation, creating props, the whole thing, you know, sound design. And then the second year,

we took over writing as well. So we wrote it, shot it, actors, all that kind of thing. We just wrapped up the third year of doing this. And yeah, it's one of our favorite because we have to shoot all the different options. you know, all the different scenes.

Sara Emmerson: And, mm-hmm,

Dave Hunter: and there's a 9:00 AM and 11:00 AM services at each of the campuses. There's 7 campuses. And so they have different endings, you know, where they, they arrive at. And then after the thing is done, it's on their app, their church app, and you can play it at home and try different, uh, selections.

Sara Emmerson: Options. Oh, how fun.

Dave Hunter: Yeah. So we love that one.

Sara Emmerson: That's really great.

Dave Hunter: Second, second favorite project we do is, uh, we do documentaries for businesses or churches on significant year anniversary, like a 10-year anniversary. Yeah. 25-year anniversary, 50-year. So we've done several of those, and we really like coming in as an outside expert to learn your story and help tell your story to people who've never heard of you, who are maybe arriving at your church or your business for the first time. Mm-hmm. And we can communicate it without knowing all of your internal language or politics or whatever, and tell it in a really compelling way using a good amount of time and plot devices and stuff that we know from storytelling and directing. Um, so we really like working on those as well. We've done a handful of those.

Sara Emmerson: That's really exciting. Very exciting. And I've gotten to see some just recently, one of the anniversary videos you did, um, for a camp, and it was incredible. I, I already told you this in person, um, but I don't know a lot of people that can make interview videos feel enticing and exciting. Like oftentimes it feels like a talking head and You just continue to, um, find new ways to make things that other people maybe, um, can't, uh, make interesting. Super interesting. And I really felt like I was at the camp. Like you had shown everything from even the food people were eating to the experience of where people were sleeping. Like I was, I felt like I had been to that camp before and had such a vested interest in it when I got done watching it. Um, And so there was so many, uh, inspirational and meaningful moments in it. And so, um, if you're somebody listening to this and you need someone to help with a video like that, please contact Dave and his team. They are incredible at that.

Dave Hunter: Yeah, we are. Um, couple green— yeah, go ahead.

Sara Emmerson: No, you go ahead.

Dave Hunter: I was gonna say Green Room Video is, uh, if you're looking for us, you can Google greenroomvideo.com or Instagram Green Room Video.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah, definitely. Um, okay. Couple of, uh, other questions for you. Um, One, tell us about like business life right now. How is business life going for you?

Dave Hunter: So we're actually having a down year this year, which is scary for me. You know, we've had, we, a few years ago we hit $1.2 million as a company, top line number, which was like, I can't believe this is even real. Like, how is that even a real thing? You know? And then we lost a really large client and then like a medium-sized client. So we went, we dropped down to like $900,000. Something like that. And then we were like $850,000 the next year. So, you know, decently. This year we are year to date, we're $160,000 under where we were last year, year to date. And so I'm sort of in the situation where I'm now starting to pull away a little bit of money for payroll. I had to pull from our profit account. Yeah. I think we're going to— I think we're going to break even in the year. Like we're going to be okay. But I'm used to having profit and stuffing profit away. And, and, you know, we currently have an emergency fund for the business of $100,000 for payroll. So that'll like float 3 or 4 months of payroll in a worst-case scenario because we don't do debt. We're a big no-debt company. So we don't have any credit cards. We don't have any car payments. We don't owe anything to anybody and we don't do lines of credit. So that money is in there for worst-case scenario. I haven't had to pull from that yet. But I'm a little worried that January, February,

I might have to, because the second half of this year really has been the killer for us. Like July on July to— we're like October right now. So it's scary. And interestingly enough, my church where I attend is going through a capital campaign right now where they're asking for giving money for— Yeah. And part of the walk of it is like, are you— where are you at with trusting God and where are you at with your finances and what you're willing to let go of? And I'm like, this is not good timing for this.

Sara Emmerson: You're like, you should have asked me 3 years ago.

Dave Hunter: Yeah, I— yes. Uh, but you know, these kinds of things are never about giving from your extra. It's always about, you know, giving first fruits. And, and, you know, so it's a little bit of a journey I'm, I'm walking through right now. And, you know, it's interesting that I've actually learned in the past month or so how much, uh, I— of my peace is attached to money. Like, when it's high, I have more peace, and when it's low, I do not have a lot of peace, you know? Yeah. And so I'm working through that at the moment and also right-sizing what's normal for, for me and, and what's normal for other business owners. I'm in a mastermind group with other video production owners that we meet every month for a couple, you know, twice a month. And, you know, hearing their stories and getting their perspectives, I'm like, oh, actually, I'm in way better shape than a lot of them would be in my situation. Yeah. And it's— so that's a little humbling, but to figure out where my threshold is in terms of being afraid. So that's something I'm currently navigating right now.

Sara Emmerson: Well, thanks for letting us into that. And I think that's something that, uh, many of us business owners struggle with is when we start, we can, uh, often, uh, many that have grit and that have the know-how and skill like you do, it, it's up into the right. Like we're growing, we're building, and the recognition of every year isn't going to be that way. It's, it's just not, that's not realistic. It's not always going to be up into the right. Um, and so, Recognizing that that graph is gonna have some dips and valleys and high points too. And, um, that that's normal as a business owner rather. And I think, right, what you just said was normalizing that by talking to other people, recognizing that, getting other voices like a business coach or like other, um, people that have been through it, uh, is so helpful because it, it really does help us silence that, um, scarcity mindset that comes in.

Dave Hunter: Yeah. Yeah. And there's a certain amount of— there's like a story you start telling yourself, you know, I'm gonna have to let go of somebody, or I— we're not going to make payroll, or we're not— you know, you start believing things that you tell yourself, and it's hard to keep those in check if you don't have another outside source speaking into that.

Sara Emmerson: Well, and then that affects, um, possible clients too, right? If, if I'm living in scarcity and I'm living in the fear, what am I going to be like coming into contact with other clients? Or what am I going to limit myself from doing, right? I often see people limit themselves from putting themselves out there, um, because they're, they're telling themselves, well, it's a down year. And I'm like, well, there's 2 months left, right? Yeah. Let's go. Like,

Dave Hunter: yeah.

Sara Emmerson: And so often we, that inner dialogue keeps us from doing the things that we would normally have done in a, like you just said, when, when you have more money, your, your peace is higher and you're going after it with, with such excitement. But the downtime when we actually need to be going a— after it with excitement, we limit ourselves sometimes from that. Yeah. And so, How do you get clients? How do you find clients? And how do you keep that grit high in seasons where you don't necessarily have the piece?

Dave Hunter: I'm working on that right now, Sarah. Most of our clients come from referral, as I think a lot of entrepreneurs, you know, being referred to other people from other people.

Sara Emmerson: Yeah.

Dave Hunter: That's the majority. We've done some cold email marketing outreach. We hired a company recently and not a lot came from that. sort of spare the details, but we got several meetings from it, and we've— we learned a lesson that a cold lead is a completely different thing than a warm lead who was referred to you or who has an interest in what you do. Like, because a cold lead doesn't know who you are, what you do, if they're fit, if they even need you. And we didn't really know how to talk to cold leads, so, you know, we learned that lesson. Um, what we're currently doing is a 2-pronged approach. One is going Going to existing customers and seeing if there's additional work that needs to be done because we already have the relationship with them.

Sara Emmerson: Yep.

Dave Hunter: Maybe even customers we haven't done anything for a couple years, reaching back out, you know, checking in with them. Um, so that's one because they're already sort of, uh, qualified leads, if you will, and there's no trust issues.

Sara Emmerson: And they've had good experiences with you.

Dave Hunter: Right, right. So that's the number one thing. And then, and then secondly, uh, asking them for referrals or people they know that might need us as well. That's another thing we're currently working on. And then one of the things I'm doing in the next few days is I'm, I'm going to print out my invoices from the last 2 to 3 years and try to narrow down a more specific target for if we were going to pick one type of thing to go after, like one type of client, who would that be? Because we serve a lot of different, so it's a little bit hard to say who our target market is, you know. We're sort of like a painter who's like, I could paint anything, but that's not helpful. You know, I need, I need you to tell me I paint interiors of houses for suburban families. Like, they're like, oh, okay. Yeah. That's who I need. If somebody is like, I paint stuff, then I'm like, well, you paint wagons or you paint, you know, barns?

Sara Emmerson: You're like, yes, yes, I paint stuff. Yeah, yeah. I can paint whatever.

Dave Hunter: Yeah. So I'm trying to get to where I can say, you know, we paint interiors of houses and figure out what is that for us? You know, what is the specific niche? that we wanna get more of that we're really good at? You know, what is that? So that's my, uh, homework for the next week or so.

Sara Emmerson: Well, and I think that's the scary part too, uh, so many of the entrepreneurs and business owners that I work with, and this has been something I've struggled with in the past too, and, um, am working through, is when you are able to serve so many different types of people, it feels like, I think you said this, um, a, a bit ago about like you're leaving money on the table. Like it, like if I go to this one, niche or niche, am I supposed to, um, just go after them? What about all the other people that I could help too? And what I wanna say to any of you that are listening today, um, and to you too, Dave, is that you, you can choose one and go after them. And then guess what? You can choose the other one in another season too. Like you don't have to only choose that one and stick with that one forever. And I think that's where we feel like, well, what if that one, What if that well dries up and you're like, well, guess what? Then you go and you find another one. That's okay. You can, you can shift. And that's what the pivoting is all about. And, um, and you see, like for you, you get a client and it's in the nonprofit area or in a hospital or in all, and then you're like, great, I know how to do that. How do I market to those people for right now? And then you can choose a different one in a different season. So. Yeah,

Dave Hunter: absolutely.

Sara Emmerson: Well, Dave, I've got some lightning round questions for you here real quick, and then we always end on a final question that I have for every guest that comes. So I'm gonna go into those quickly if that's okay with you.

Dave Hunter: Let's do it.

Sara Emmerson: Especially with your cool lights behind you, we've got to do the lightning round, right? Okay. What feels riskier, a live improv stage or pitching a big client?

Dave Hunter: Pitching a big client.

Sara Emmerson: Are you an overthinker or a jump in and figure it out?

Dave Hunter: Jump in and figure it out.

Sara Emmerson: What's one lesson from improv that everyone could use in everyday life?

Dave Hunter: It's easier to add to an idea than come up with your own.

Sara Emmerson: What's the most unexpected place your work has taken you?

Dave Hunter: Minsk, Belarus.

Sara Emmerson: Wow. What's something your daughters have taught you about courage?

Dave Hunter: Oh boy. Sometimes just getting back in the ring is courage enough.

Sara Emmerson: What's a mistake you can laugh about now?

Dave Hunter: I immediately thought of like hitting an employee's butt, but I didn't do that. So that's not one of them. A mistake I could laugh about now. Oh man,

Sara Emmerson: too many to think of.

Dave Hunter: I called, I called a client's, uh, company the wrong name one time.

Sara Emmerson: Oh yeah, that one's hard. No, that one's hard. Yeah, I've, I haven't done that, but I have called them, uh, the wrong name or spelled their name incorrectly, and that felt really not right. Sorry. Um, finish the sentence: I wish more people would say yes to

Dave Hunter: Hmm. Adventures.

Sara Emmerson: Mm-hmm. And what's one risk you still wanna take?

Dave Hunter: I would like to do a documentary about raising kids in a Christian household that's personally funded, uh, and figure out how to get it out there.

Sara Emmerson: That would be an incredible documentary to watch. So I hope that you make that happen.

Dave Hunter: Thanks.

Sara Emmerson: And then here is our final question. And it's this, if you could encourage everyone listening to take one risk in their life, what risk would that be?

Dave Hunter: I think, um, Telling somebody you haven't talked to in a long time that you love them and miss them.

Sara Emmerson: Hmm. Yes, agreed. That is definitely one that each of us should take. You don't have to tell us right now, but is there anyone that came to mind right away when you said that?

Dave Hunter: No, I was just thinking about like what would be an answer that would be universal, you know? And, you know, oftentimes I was listening to a podcast recently about how You know, when you get older and start to feel lonely or like, because, you know, your world starts to shrink as you get older. Oftentimes the friends that you need in your life are friends you used to have in your life. And just going back and rekindling that is, it's kind of like going back to your existing clients. Like it's an easier and it's usually reciprocated. And, you know, you're glad that you did that.

Sara Emmerson: It's so true.

Dave Hunter: It's harder when you're older to keep friendships because of kids and schedules and Entrepreneurship and working and traveling, you know, to keep friendships or relationship with family, uh, important is, it's just harder. So it, it takes an intentional choice to do that.

Sara Emmerson: It really does. Uh, and I experienced that my birthday was a couple weeks ago. Um, and I turned a large number that I am, that I'm very aware of. Um, um, but, but it's, it's fine. It's fine. Uh, 50 is great, guys. If you're wondering if 50's great, it is. It is. So far so good. But, um, I put on Instagram, um, that I would love, and Facebook, that anybody that I have known, if they could tell me how they met me or like a funny story from the past. And I can't tell you how many people, um, were telling funny stories that I had forgotten about and friends that were like, hey, we should get together this year. People that I went to junior high with that, um, and high school with that I was like, oh, and my heart was so moved. Um, because I was like, oh, I, I, and exactly what you said, I need those people back in my life. I, those people were so meaningful to me. And, and then I got into survival mode, moved to a different, um, state. I haven't seen them in years, but I'm like, oh gosh, they still hold such an important, uh, place in my heart. And so I've been able to connect with lots of people in that way just in the last couple weeks. And I can guarantee if you choose to do that, for anyone that's listening to reconnect with people. It makes a huge, huge difference. Um,

Dave Hunter: yeah, we're not, we're not meant to do this life alone.

Sara Emmerson: No, we aren't. We aren't. Well, Dave, thank you so much for being here with us today. Tell everyone where they, I know you mentioned it once, but let's just have it all clear. Where can they find you? Where they can, they follow you? How can they hire you?

Dave Hunter: Yeah, well, we're looking for some more video projects. So if you feel like you wanna see if what our quote would be, or just, just do a little quick meeting, you know, greenroomvideo.com, Green Room Video. And if you're local to the Chicago area, you wanna come see improv, go to greenroomimprov.com. Greenroomimprov.com. Green Room Video.

Sara Emmerson: Love it. Love it. And I highly encourage all of you to check Dave out. And if you're in the season where you're trying to figure out your next step, what's your next bold move? What are you supposed to do in your job, in your life, in your business? I wanna let you know that's what I do. That's the spaces I love sitting in with high performers. So if that's you and you're like, yeah, Sarah, I need some help. Go to sarahemerson.com and sign up for a consult. I would love to talk to you about what that next bold move is and how to take it and what your best next risk is. So that's a big word, uh, sentence, best next risk. So anyway, we will talk to you soon. Can't wait to see you again soon, Dave. Thanks for being here today and bye everyone. Hope you have a great day.